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#26580 - 03/16/19 12:14 AM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
Hmmm, not sure where to start.

The year that my buddy John showed me his method of grafting, he'd ordered the rootstock and told me that it was some kind of Chinese crab apple.

Honestly, I don't know what my rootstock is supposed to be, other than "M 111". From what I've read about the rootstock, it's supposed to be suitable to my growing zone, somewhat hearty, and resistant to this or that.

Just thinking about it now, the government and schools have spent a pile of money trying to find a better rootstock. There's big money in apples.

But you really can't just plant the seeds from a Golden Delicious apple and expect to grow a tree of the same variety. If the tree does grow, it'll be some kind of seedling. Who knows what?

But look at the pictures above, if my grafts take and grow like they're supposed to do, from that point up, the tree will the exact same variety apple as the tree where I got my grafting wood.

If any little sprouts do come out below my graft, I'll cut them off and treat them with the tree goop stuff.

You can graft other varieties of apples on the same tree. I did one time, my grafts worked and grew well. John and I talked about doing that, in his opinion it was best to just have 2 trees. It could cause some kind of blight or fungus.

I'll tell you this rootstock that they shipped me is much bigger than I was expecting. That's why I'm grafting so far up the plant, the wood that I saved, is tiny compared to what I really need.

So far I've only grafted 17 of the 50 plants. I did experiment with 3 pear sprouts on the apple rootlets, we'll see what happens.


Edited by redsnow (03/16/19 12:55 AM)

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#26581 - 03/16/19 02:21 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
https://articles.extension.org/pages/60915/apple-rootstock-info:-mm111-emla

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#26582 - 03/16/19 02:52 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
FLSH ETR Online   content
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Registered: 12/29/04
Posts: 1195
Loc: Cudahy, Wisconsin,USA
OK, so, your rootstock is just a sort of a complex straw to slurp nutrients and moisture from the soil and send it up to what ever is above it. You pick the recipient of that action, through your grafting process, and you are growing exactly what you want. I'm sure you could purchase Golden Delicious apple seedlings from somewhere, but I'm guessing that would be cost prohibitive. Thanks for the explanation. I think I've got it down pat now. Or have I missed something?

Thanks man, Frank.
_________________________
"Si vis pacem,---para bellum."

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#26584 - 03/16/19 05:33 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
I've been going around this morning getting bigger grafting wood. I've got 30 of them grafted so far. I did glance at the clock before I started today, after taking pictures and all, I did 8 in less than 40 minutes. Five minutes each. These are the best looking ones so far. Red Delicious.



Wish I'd known before what size rootstock they were sending.

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#26585 - 03/16/19 10:21 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
Not sure? I'll tell you a little bit about prices.

The rootstock that I bought cost me $105 for 50 pieces. I was going to buy 100 pieces, that was going to cost me $145 total. That's shipping included, for both. Well, between morning and noon, they had the 100 pack listed as out of stock. Kind of strange that I could have bought 2 fifty packs, but the 100 pack was out of stock. I could have had another 50 trees for $40 more. I kind of got the shaft on that deal. 100 is too many, 50 isn't enough. Fifty will do.

About 5 years ago a man that owns an orchard sold me 8 golden delicious trees for $12 each, $100. I got grafting wood from one of those trees this morning. I'm probably graft 8 or so on my rootstock.

The local co-op is selling fruit trees now, I wasn't interested in buying any, but asked the price. They are good looking, potted trees about 7 feet tall, they're priced at $39.99 each.

(The manager at the co-op did give me a 35% discount on 2 pairs of insulated bibs. So I saved $70 on that deal. Now is the time to buy winter stuff.)

I just checked online, found a place in Wisconsin that had apple trees, what they listed as quote: 2' to 3' whip". I assume they mean trees that are 2 to 3 feet tall, they were priced at $22 each.

I'll keep an eye on my trees, but I expect the majority of them to somewhere around 30 inches tall a year from now. If you're doing the math, that would only be 3 trees from the co-op.

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#26586 - 03/17/19 12:10 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
In the link above they mentioned "water sprouts", or suckers. They make good grafting wood, fairly straight, easy to work with.





In the last picture notice the ring at ground level, that's where the tree was grafted. The little sprouts on the main trunk, they would also make good grafting wood.

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#26587 - 03/18/19 02:14 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
Well, I didn't think that we were on the same page. I did a search: Planting apple seeds. I found a link from Penn State University, if you plant the seeds from a Golden Delicious apple, if they grow, you're going to end up with some kind of hybrid. The only way to have the exact same type of tree is either grafting or budding. Budding is another form of grafting.


https://extension.psu.edu/hobbiest-gardening-growing-fruit-tree-plants-from-seed


https://www.thespruce.com/can-you-grow-apples-from-seeds-3269511

https://www.almanac.com/plant/apples


Edited by redsnow (03/18/19 07:01 PM)

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#26588 - 03/18/19 11:13 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
That makes 42.



They shipped me 52 pieces of rootstock, I'm going to graft 8 more, and experiment with the last 2.

I put the 2 biggest pieces of rootstock in a bag full of moss, sealed the top ends with tree goop, and have them sitting upright at around 15* below room temperature. They'll get a little bit of sunlight. Somehow or another, these folks grow rootstock. I'd like to know how that works.

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#26589 - 03/19/19 11:57 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV
Years ago there was an apple orchard on the mountain east of town, I went up there today and got some twigs. I found about a dozen trees that are somewhat alive, couldn't find much wood suitable for grafting. Pretty much all of the folks that had anything to do with the orchard are long gone. I've heard that back in the 20's it was a busy place.








Edited by redsnow (03/20/19 12:32 AM)

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#26590 - 03/20/19 05:27 PM Re: Grafting apple trees, 2019 [Re: redsnow]
redsnow Online   content
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Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 3001
Loc: WV



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